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This week in Bitcoin- 6-15-2018- Argentina, Tether FUD, SEC talks ICO securities

August 14, 2019


Hello everyone this is adam meister the
bitcoinmeister the disrupt meister
welcome to this week in bitcoin today is
June the 15th 2018 strong hand long-term
thinking confiscate able and I really
got on that uncompensated thing the
first time Jorge joined us from
Argentina Jorge is back from Argentina
to join us on this very special Friday
with some other legends ansel winners
here and Thomas Hunt from the world
crypto Network is in the freaking house
people so obviously I’m really pumped
because I literally just got done
running through the hot streets of
Florida unbelievably hot out there
relatively so let’s start with Jorge
because he is in snowy Argentina now
yes it snows in parts of Argentina and
all of us here are very curious about
the economic situation in orange and
Tina we’ve heard a lot about it in the
mainstream news and we’ve heard that
it’s great for Bitcoin but yet we don’t
ever see anyone who’s actually there so
I’m bringing you a guy there who’s there
so worried the floor is yours to tell
the world to tell the the loyal
listeners and Watchers what is going on
economically in Argentina what it means
for Bitcoin and what’s the scene in
Bitcoin in Argentina well the first
thing is Bitcoin is growing very very
strongly in Argentina because of all the
things I make you know we want to uh to
explain to you we’ve been through
situations like we’re going now through
like this is a fifth crisis that we’ve
been through I mean with some minor
crisis is that crisis too but for
instance here that you can see and only
if you can see it this is a 1 million
peso bill of 35 years ago you know and
and this is a 100,000 pace of bill over
30 years ago move it a little higher
move it up a little higher if like this
I don’t know if you can see it this is 1
this is 1 million peso bill of the
ATS you know and then they chop off a
bunch of zeros and they they go back to
a new pace or they’ve done that like
five times
I think they knocked off like 13-0 and
that’s going on and on and on and it’s a
result of printing money and nothing
else I mean the problem that Argentina
has been having the last 70 years is the
fact that the government spends more
than it gets and and that started with a
sort of a populist government during the
one Peron time in the 40s and it has
changed the culture and it has never you
know reversed and that that is a form we
are facing now and what we are facing
now I mean that’s good for good that’s
why there are so many yards and ten
years there into Bitcoin because they
they have to try to protect themselves
from government and from taxation from
from government intrusion from a change
of they change the rules all the time
and and you know there’s a lot of
uncertainty there’s a lot of legal
uncertainty so they that’s why bitcoin
is something that has been widely and I
wouldn’t say widely but strongly adopted
in Argentina and a lot of the
transactions are person-to-person most
of them although there are exchanges –
but if you want it for me to sort of
explain what the economic situation here
Argentina is I made it some a bunch of
notes you quickly go into the current
deal it’s not inflationary well what’s
it describe it they’ve raised interest
rates a lot so what does that mean for
the average citizen well they they they
raise interest rates for a citizen not
to rush into the dollar and create a
hyperinflation situation and in that for
instance I was reading an interviewer to
Doug Casey last week and he thought that
there was a good measure that the
government and did raising the interest
rate because actually it allows people
to say I mean if the interest rate is 40
percent and in fascias twenty five
percent you can make it fifty percent
there and so that that sort of stops
people for rushing into the $2 bills
which is always traditionally the act
currency in Argentine has been dollar
bills I mean use US dollars pacer is
just a nominal thing to actually pretend
that they have independence and they’re
a monetary independence but that’s so
that’s a that’s a fiction that’s not
true people think in terms of dollars
most people think and all real estate
transactions and everything else are
done and are made in or done in u.s.
dollars here in Argentina and the
mistakes I mean these people who are
running the government right now
Mauricio Macri who was a present
actually he took office in December of
2015 and they inherited it from I mean
from the very beginning they did not do
a crude and real diagnosis of a
catastrophic situation they recede from
the previous government the church nur
regime during the 12 years of a kitchen
kerchner regime they went from having
what is called twin surpluses here in
Argentina which is fiscal surplus plus
trade a foreign trade surplus to five
percent deficit and they had the best
trading conditions price-wise in two
hundred years and and taxation pressure
was one of the highest in the world they
had a huge insane sales retention the
kitchener regime on agricultural exports
as well as mining exports and oil
exports like for instance 35% direct off
the top on soybeans 20% on on wheat and
corn and all of these things they all
these things they stole all these things
for themselves so that is what they
actually inherited and they should have
actually made that public to start with
and the second mistake is having opted
while they call a gradualist method of
Corrections which
we have had several times before and it
has never been successful in Argentina
in the history of Argentina that’s
that’s well are you saying that yeah
that the medicine that you guys need to
take it’s not being directly applying
right now your graduate degree it’s a
gradual solution and whatever solution
is going to be it’s gonna be very
painful I mean they’re gonna have to
raise interest rates quite a bit the
average Argentine is gonna is gonna
notice this yeah I like how you said
that what that people value their wealth
in dollars there which means I think
they’re ready to value their wealth in
Bitcoin that’s exactly right
that’s absolutely right that’s that’s
the switch from an valuing in dollars on
to valuing and Bitcoin turn it is it’s a
nothing thing you know like they just
immediately are doing that and then
there’s a for instance the idiosyncrasy
of the average Argentine is most people
are what we call deniers we call them
Nagel Ortiz inclined to think that the
state has to take care and look after
all their needs without the least amount
of effort of sacrifice from their part
from their part who other people who
received these benefits the present
government has utilized some of the very
few thing it’s not the only one that the
Quechua regime did not destroy the
possibility of acquiring debt but in two
years this present government not only
did they get deeply into debt but also
the the world changed you know now now
the interest rates went up interest rate
starts rising and the emerging countries
start having problems acquiring debt
especially Argentina and presently now
they can’t get any external credit and
it’s impossible to raise taxes more so
there was no choice but to end up in the
IMF they should have done this on
December of 2015
they wasted 2.5 two and a half years
either because they weren’t able to do
it or they
no but they didn’t want to do where they
didn’t know how to do it so they will
have to do it now actually forced by
christine lagarde the IMF the total
amount outlay from IMF reaches 50
billion US dollars which is a record in
the history of IMF since it’s 11 times
the quota for our for a country in this
case Argentina 11 times as starting out
with a 13 billion with a quarterly
3-month follow-up on the guidelines that
are committed the term for the loan is
four years therefore it will exceed
Mauricio macri’s the President
presidential term and it involves the
next administration that could either be
Macri himself or someone in the
opposition if the opposition is halfway
reasonable they’ll find that this
agreement is convenient also to them
since it’s sort of insurers governance
for two more years and most importantly
the fact that during 2018 and 2019 all
the major fixes and adjustments to
eliminate to eliminate the deficit which
is the cancer that is eating us up will
have been made this is doable
since duhovniceasca’ meaning this and
was already reducing the deficit 2.7
percent in 2018 and 1.5 to 1 point point
seven one point seven percent for 2019
during this year 2018 the country lost
eight billion dollars in income due to a
major drought in 2019 out and better her
prices the income could reach ninety US
dollars this is of health to the
fundamental thing to understand the
situation after 70 years of failures
mistakes or miscalculation the real
currency in Argentina is the US dollar
that said before all asset
Saxon savings they’re all in terms of US
dollars
the Pacers just nominal to the only
effect of pretending and absurd
monetary independence Mochrie mauricio
macri needs to stop thinking a free
election the only way he has to go down
history is making the adjustments yeah
all that yeah let me ask you about him
because I mean obviously huge is this
government and but after my question I
know the other guys has the questions of
people one guy has sent a question in
the chat I and I’ll get to that is he
Cristina Fernandez I mean she was a
strong handed control freak I would say
and I wouldn’t I would think she’d be a
person to crack down a Bitcoin is he
gonna ignore Bitcoin does he have bigger
things to worry about they do you think
this present government will will do try
to do anything with Bitcoin or will you
guys be free to do what you want to do
with the Bitcoin no no I think the good
news is that bitcoin is is totally legal
now Jen Tina and a right this year is
started to become what they call it
digital money before until last year
until December of last year was just I
know how to explain it a thing you just
declared he had Bitcoin like you declare
you have a chair or furniture or
something like that it didn’t it wasn’t
anything it wasn’t it wasn’t an asset it
wasn’t a security wasn’t a now it is
considered digital money and eventually
they may want to tax it but it’s totally
legal you can have Bitcoin there are
exchanges there are transactions there
you know all kinds of transactions I
think personally that most of the
transactions made in Bitcoin I are
person to person because Argentinians
after 70 years of trying to fight the
government and to hide their money from
the government have developed skills to
hide the money and they’d rather have
that govern not know what they have then
know what they have you know and so
Bitcoin is a very good I mean I mean
everybody has had you know accounts in
Uruguay and other countries and all that
to actually protect your their their
that their wealth their belongings and
bitcoin is
very very good tool to uh to accomplish
that
that is there’s also exchanges so you
can link your your your bank account to
the exchange account and buy a Bitcoin
online to that a lot of people do that
yeah but most of the market is a
spontaneous market at first now uh Ansel
or Thomas do you have any questions for
Jorge Thomas you know first if you want
alright let’s see well I wrote down some
notes I just think this is a great thing
this is what bitcoins for people often
say why can’t I buy my coffee with
Bitcoin why is it not faster all these
kind of things and we say censorship
resistance people in other countries and
here we actually have a person from
another country their currency is bad
and they have another option now that’s
what I think is really exciting
previously like you said they were using
the dollar similar to Ecuador that just
uses the dollar default Lee and now they
have this other option this Bitcoin and
it reminds me of the Cyprus event in
2013 when the Cyprus Bank started
seizing the people’s money the people
realized that holding money in the bank
was a bad idea and they started pulling
their money out and they started buying
Bitcoin and just as for a question
basically just commenting on the skills
to hide money we have people here that
say if I’m not doing anything wrong what
does it matter is that a common attitude
and Argentina or do people not trust the
government not trust the banks more by
default if it doesn’t matter I mean no
it’s not the way mine said that people
are latina have well my mindset is I
don’t care if I have something to to
hide or not you know nobody has a right
to ask me what I have why I have why
what I got it from or anything that’s
not a right that nobody including
government has has and and that’s that’s
it
period and here people actually value
that that concept so much that they they
it’s a principle it’s not just a
strategy it is a principle
I feel that way about privacy a lot of
people say they don’t need privacy or
it’s not important to them but when you
miss privacy when it’s gone then you
realize how important it was and what a
basic part of being human it is and it’s
not just that I have something to hide
it’s that I want my privacy well of
course I mean you sir are realizing how
how important privacy is when when when
you don’t want you know anybody else
including the government but anybody
else to actually see from you or or try
to break into your house or something
like that you know the moment anybody
knows that you’re you have somebody is
something you you’re you’re at risk so
people understand here that it’s not
just because they are afraid of
government seizing their funds which
they have done so in friends in 2001
that was terrible what they did and yeah
but because of the principle
fundamentally that nobody has any right
to you have the obligation you’re not
forced to declare done fest but your
home and you do that the only purpose
for anybody else to know what you have
is to take it away from you there’s no
other purpose no matter how what they
say a woman claimed the only purpose is
to take it away from you otherwise they
shouldn’t have to ask you that’s mine
might take sure I’ve got just one more
question then I’ll throw it over to
Ansel you mentioned that Bitcoin is
illegal and I was wondering did they
make a specific law saying Bitcoin is
illegal or is it more like India well
anything that there isn’t a law
permitting is by default illegal
he said it’s legal all great yeah it’s
legal I mean Thomas it is it is legal I
mean that’s a good thing I mean they
made a league I mean it make it they
they didn’t they didn’t even there was
no no warrants I mean you know it’s are
they just there an official statement
from the current government saying it is
legal or is it just up in the air or did
they say this because because sometimes
it’s Lee
by default because they say it was
illegal but has the cover current
government made a statement on it yeah
they have they have made a statement on
that they made it legal in writing and
they published awesome but that’s that’s
really good that’s surprising they did
invite that competition in I’d be
worried about that if I was running a
central bank and printing money well I
think I personally I personally think
that a lot of the people in the
government owned Bitcoin so I think that
maybe one of the reasons why they did
that but I mean before that I remember
last year they they actually didn’t give
Bitcoin any any category of anything it
was just a saying that you could declare
on your belongings the one thing you
never know in this country is how they
are going to tax you next year because
they change all the time so a lot of
people are you know some of the people
would like to go and declare that they
do have the Bitcoin other people don’t
know what to do because now they will
come up with a set of rules and next
year they’re gonna change them you know
that’s been happening for all my life I
mean for 70 years or 80 years in this
country so you never know whether you
better declare what you have or you
don’t and a lot of people are inclined
not to declare what they have because it
it creates a vulnerable area it becomes
vulnerable to any any any you know
eventual new laws or regulation I
definitely would not declare because
eventually I think the 80 percenters in
your country will elect a person like
cristina fernandez again and it’s just
if the whole thing will get restarted
this is a this regime economically is
much better than the previous one but
unfortunately i mean you guys have a
history of defaulting back to the
Cristina’s of the world so I will see
what I mean
that’s the whole thing about Bitcoin
it’s it’s you’re not supposed to declare
it let me tell you let me tell you and
I’m for instance I mean I was I’m
reading the Casey’s uh interview last
week and he actually I agree with him he
says my
Kri impresses me as an okay guy probably
the most decent head of any major state
in the worlds today and he says that and
I agree with him I mean he’s a good guy
I mean I wouldn’t say I would take it
but think about he’s a decent guy he’s
not an active criminal the ones we had
before where indeed active criminals I
mean that was that’s that’s what they
were so and actually he just didn’t get
it I think he guesses he has had his
philosophy wrong it’s been surrounded by
Kenji Kenji ins and and the first
measures he took were not you know he
didn’t do the adjustments he needed to
do when he started off you know I mean
and it’s very simple I mean you can’t
Argentina is not viable because taxation
is extremely high if you if you put
everything together to combine all the
taxes it goes up to between 70 and 75
percent so you’re out of 12 months
you’re the normal people are working
nine months for the government and three
months for themselves on their families
so they are forced to cheat or to avoid
taxes or to declare you know or to just
make up statements and things like that
because that because I said the only way
they can survive and so that is a result
of a gigantic government and I can I can
have it here from Noth oh wow
for the people to turn their pesos in
the Bitcoin seriously dude seriously
Argentines well I mean I didn’t I didn’t
your question now I was just saying it
now’s the time for I was saying that if
you’re in our time the day he throws in
the Bitcoin it’s it’s time it’s
definitely so a answer what do you
answer you got a question you have a
question but I wanted to have a few
stats up here up front
this Argentina yesterday the exchange
rate between the dollar and the
Argentine peso went down 10 percent so
it’s it’s happening very very quickly so
I went from 25 pesos per dollar
yesterday
to 27.5 pesos in one day which is pretty
amazing this it but it’s not just in
Argentina a lot of places around the
country that their currencies are really
weak have been raising interest rates
because the Fed is cutting back on their
balance sheet they’re you know sucking
the dollars out of these emerging
markets India and Indonesia specifically
have had surprise rate hikes in a last I
think one or two weeks so this is
happening all over the place is what
happens when we let bankers run you know
the world we give our money over to the
bankers and they’re gonna use it against
us
my question is for Jorge nice to meet
you by the way Jorge thanks for coming
on this is interesting so this is a
fifth crisis you said in 70 years I’m
aware of some previous ones I was
wondering since it’s so repetitive
during any periods of stability are
there things that people do to prepare
like you know I know you said they hold
a lot of their money in US dollars is
there anything else that they do and
second part of the question is can
people kind of tell by the rhetoric when
this these type of policies are gonna
get really bad and you know how what
does it sound like from the government
so we have know what to look out for
well and in the past
Wow the first the fresh answer would be
people just hold dollars or people have
been opening accounts on in foreign
countries or they could protect your
their funds which before it was legal
and then they made it illegal but they
still did have to do that and people buy
real estate you know and that is one of
the things they do they try to get rid
of a peso as soon as fast as I can
because the pace off becomes devalue
that the you know and so it’s either
dollars whether in the country or
outside the country it’s either
real estate and and not much more
and the other question not much more so
people suffer of that some people are
not able I mean they’re working class is
not able to actually have their money
and in a foreign account because they
don’t have they don’t have the knowledge
in order to do that that is a problem so
the middle class and the upper class
they they they do they have been able to
do that and and the other question is
where the people for instance the first
major major collapse that I witness it
was in 1975 it caught everybody off
guard and and nobody was expecting it
and the second one was in 82 again it
caught everybody off guard and so people
suffered the third one was an 89
hyperinflation big time you know and
this is when these things happened you
know though the 1 million all the ones
we face of bail and things like that
again
you got everybody off guard and the yeah
I mean they now people are very
sensitive by the one in 2001 I
remembered that when the there was the
president Delarue president de la rúa
resigned and was replaced by do all day
do all this said that because people
here that’s one of the other things you
can you can have a bank account in in
terms of argentine pesos but you can
also have a bank account with dollars
now the difference is that the Argentine
government does not print dollars they
can print pesos but not dollars so if
they run out of the central bank runs
out of dollars those dodge that you’re
supposed to have in your account in
dollars are not backed by anything so in
2001 President wall day in spite of
saying on TV that those who had dollars
would get dollars what the next thing he
did he turned the dollars into pesos
back then it was
the dollar one-to-one artificially
because the distortion had been enough
that it wasn’t one-to-one I shouldn’t
have to be one-to-one so he actually for
those who had dollars he said now that
those who have dollars now have faces 1
2 1 we have $1,000 now you had a
thousand face next things he did he
devalued the peso so now the dollar is
for Nami they went or equals 4 pesos
back then in 2001 so if you had a
thousand dollars now you have $250 and
that happened in 2001 and actually the
the the deposits were already frozen so
you couldn’t withdraw that money
even the pesos that you had to run out
run off and buy dollars in the black
market or something like that at gold
and then Kirchner also banned gold for
in suggest I’m changing subject about
the future president presidency was
after 2003 so we’ve been through
situations like that back and again all
the time I mean not to the point for the
country to become like Venezuela right
now because the Adams been here shortly
I mean some a bunch of months ago and
you know it looks like normal and it it
it and Argentinians are used to these
things and but they now are very
sensitive to the situation because
they’ve been four times this would be
the fifth one and now they are very
sensitive and that because they can
remember very very clearly what happened
2001 and they are afraid of that
situation you know coming back and
that’s why I think the gutless
government has I know had to end up
dealing with the IMF I’ll say this with
the history that you just told I don’t
see how any person in Argentina I mean
that hat that knows about Bitcoin isn’t
buying Bitcoin at this point I mean it’s
it’s definitely worth the risk because
it isn’t much of a risk compared to the
risk of holding the peso and I want to
add when the Argentine’s the smart ones
were buying real estate
it’s there’s a domino effect was a lot
of them would buy condos out in
Montevideo and Uruguay and it drives up
the prices of condos there so the people
Uruguay can’t afford it
I’ve heard all sorts of different things
I have a question I know Ansel you might
have a follow-up a drunk one real quick
thing does mention me Towe sent a $5
super Chad he’s got a question
he said Jorge I remember that they seize
retirement accounts about 10 years back
I think I think he cried means like 2001
what of what effect did that have do
people still have such vulnerable
accounts now that’s a good question in
terms of retirement
yeah well they actually didn’t come to
skate account they nationalized yeah
they took all the that the retirement
was private back until 2008 and and all
of a sudden they nationalized it and
took all the funds and and of course if
you want to retire now the state is
gonna pay you if you’re paid the
retirement to you and not the any
private entity that’s what they did that
was an esterification was no Cristina it
was 2008 Cristina Fernandez de Kirchner
did in 2008 yeah I was in Norway fishing
for salmon when that happened all right
so – then so now those old-style
so it’s all government their retirement
accounts are still controlled by the
government completely you rely your
retirement yet is with the government
yes that’s all right dad so did you have
any other questions for us all right
nope I don’t
all right dudes well there you go people
that is the update from Argentina and
what’s going on there how it relates to
Bitcoin I think everyone can see you
know when people say oh there’s no use
case for Bitcoin well tell them to watch
the first 1/2 hour this show okay see it
seriously I mean king of the trolls and
all those dudes should be watching this
okay so now we’re going to move on to
what speaking of governments the the sec
has said is talk in securities what’s
the secure
what’s not a security well a theory I’m
in Bitcoin or not securities well we all
knew Bitcoin wasn’t the etherium thing
some people were shocked about and a lot
icos are securities so Thomas what’s
going on with this stuff elaborate tell
us what’s your opinion what’s going on
well basically we talked about both
sides of this for years we would say
that aetherium had a crowd sale they had
no product they had no code and they had
a countdown timer and if you invested in
that countdown timer you’re a
millionaire now so congratulations
but for everyone else who said there’s
nothing here this is probably a security
and a securities of stock it’s something
you sell to build a company they sold
ether to build their company then they
built their company it was strange to
see the SEC say that there’s no central
figure when we all know vitalic booter
ins essential figure of etherium and
that there’s no central company when
there’s the etherium foundation which
was given a lot of aetherium what the
FBI said yes are the SEC what they said
yesterday was that at this time we don’t
think that there’s any value to seeing
ether as a security they’re kind of
saying that maybe you broke the law
years ago but now you’re too big to fail
and we’re not gonna go after you because
it’s too difficult or maybe they don’t
even know how to go after them but what
I find is this puts them in a hard
position considering all the other icos
I don’t see how all the other icos are
different from aetherium I don’t see how
they’re not securities now – it seems
like the SEC just gave up their entire
job what they’re supposed to do
regulating industries like this and
everyone that said oh it’s a security
the law will come through was wrong
everyone who said do what you want break
the law do what you want
go ahead they are winners now so this is
a very strange thing for the law to do I
saw some great tweets by John Carvalho
Bitcoin errorlog he also runs or works
for that site exotica TV and they very
easily could have done one of these I
cos they could have done a crowd fund
and he talks that he chose not to he
thought it was illegal he thought they’d
come to get him and he followed the law
and now we have a situation where he’s
punished and other people who had no
no code just a countdown timer raised
millions of dollars and now it seems
that there is no law and you can break
the law at will so I think it’s a very
very strange decision by the SEC even
seeing lots of crypto people celebrated
and Barry Silbert DCG sweat out a tweet
where he said the entire crypto
community is breathing a sigh of relief
and the only reason you do that is if
you were uncertain about your position
in the law or if you’ve been breaking
the law and you just got a get out of
jail free card so it’s an absolutely
shocking decision as much as I know
people are very happy about it the
etherium people and others Wow
I love what Thomas just said aetherium
too big to fail just like I mean wow how
bad like button people if you realize
atom and forgotten to say that yet all
right so Ansel you obviously have a
follow-up to that yeah so first off
Thomas you said that the this is a
strange thing for government to do I
don’t think so I think government is
generally incompetent and that they’ve
made this huge mistake whether it’s good
or bad I mean it’s it’s an incompetent
it’s a mistake of incompetence so I I
don’t think it’s very strange now I
don’t support anything the SEC does so I
don’t care if they would have said it
was in a it was a security or wasn’t a
security I of my big fight is to say
that the SEC should not even exist right
like who cares who cares what what the
SEC says if you are decentralized if
they’re decentralized like the SEC said
aetherium is decentralized if they’re
decentralized and censor should resist
it it doesn’t matter what they say it
doesn’t matter if they say Bitcoin is a
security because bitcoin is just gonna
laugh at them right and and they can’t
say that though because everyone will
laugh at SEC and the SEC can’t stand
that they can’t have everybody laughing
at them because then nobody would listen
to anything they say right so they can’t
regulate these things because they’re
impotent anyway
let’s see I think it’s a false dichotomy
it’s not whether they will regulate it
or not regulate it there’s a third
choice there’s many choices one would be
make aetherium truly decentralized and
censorship resistant another option
would be that the SEC could say we’re
clueless we don’t know so we’re not
gonna do anything that that’s another
option another option would be to say or
for the FCC to just shut up about it
just not saying anything what we don’t
care what they say so being happy about
some person in the ruling class saying
that my what I did was okay I just think
that this is we’re looking at this from
the wrong angle and I don’t really care
what the government says I want to add
basically I was gonna read this tweet
off and amazingly ants will just
conveyed this thought but I want to read
it anyway Matt Odell said if a
government classified Bitcoin as a
security it wouldn’t matter that’s the
point
so that basically just said that before
that Thomas has his a brood bottle
because I know he’s got some more things
to say I want a segue into Jorge you
just heard about Ansel doesn’t care what
the government has to say I think you
what do you think about government’s
state what do you think about this I
mean you definitely you’re not a big fan
of government no you know especially if
you have lived in Argentina you cannot
be a fan of governments I mean if you
want to learn about the nature of
government just know spent some years in
Argentina you will yeah I don’t care
what they do what they say personally
and and people seem not to care I mean I
can see that being especially young
people most of the bitcoiners here in
argentina the people who are into a
crypto are young people I don’t I
haven’t I have never met anybody who’s
older than me and and and they don’t
care they just don’t care
just like they haven’t they didn’t care
when they had to hide their money on in
in foreign countries foreign accounts or
you know you know they they don’t care
because they it’s a it’s it’s it that
they are risking their lives their risk
of their families they’re risking their
future and they don’t care I personally
don’t care what they but the good news
is that they have they haven’t they have
made it legal and there hasn’t been any
argument or anything you know it it’s
that that is a very very good thing
because that enables a lot of the people
who are not into a Bitcoin space to
consider entering the Bitcoin space the
fact that it is legal here alright now I
want to go back to Thomas um where we
Ansel said a lot of things you you
probably have some follow us to what he
was saying alright I’m gonna disagree
with some of the things Ansel said I’m
gonna start out he said if Bitcoin is a
security no one cares and I agree with
this and it’s because of the fundamental
parts of Bitcoin Bitcoin was created by
an anonymous creator Satoshi Nakamoto we
don’t know who he is Bitcoin was created
in a pretty fair way if you were there
on day one and you volunteered to mine
your in how Finney
mattias a couple of other early people
mind early those are the people who
benefited from the early knowledge it
wasn’t a crowd sale there wasn’t an
announcement there wasn’t a pre amount
of bitcoins that Satoshi held that he’s
now spending there is an early pre mine
but it’s held there it hasn’t moved but
I would now I’d contrast that with
aetherium if aetherium is not a security
or well if a theorem is a security what
are the problems well you got this
centralized control with vitalic booter
in the creator
he’s already rolled back the chain once
which is changing the outcomes making it
in beautiful your transactions that you
sent her sent back people who hacked
money they took the money away from them
and they’ve talked about fixing it again
several times to fix so other smart
contracts that are broken other large
amounts of money that are losses they’ve
even talked about having a process for
applying to rollback the chain
judging whose application is valid and
having even an automated or a regular
programmable system that would allow you
to roll back the chain
so if aetherium was a security you could
shut down vitalic you could shut down
the etherion foundation and you could
shut down this whole chain rolling back
thing or you could force it or you could
make it a government function or
something so aetherium has a lot to lose
by being labeled as security so first I
think is an important announcement if it
happened in a Bitcoin I agree it’s not
important but that’s the differences
between these two projects and this
leads into a great tweet that I saw by
Kevin Pham where Kevin said now you can
say without a doubt that
etherium is a government-sponsored
attack on Bitcoin etherium is backed by
the corporation’s etherium is backed by
IBM aetherium has now have government
support saying that they’re not a
security at the same time the government
saying all these other icos that did the
exact same thing are securities so now
we have a government backed challenger
against Bitcoin the anonymous pseudo
anonymous currency and you may not care
what the government says and that’s fine
but you better care what the government
does and the government is now siding
with aetherium over bitcoin so going
back to the SEC and that they shouldn’t
do anything we have a basic disagreement
of principles there the SEC is designed
to protect people from scams I think
that’s a good purpose I think when they
do act to shut down scams they are
protecting people and they were trying
to help Ansel probably has more of a
government should have hands off let
people fail let people lose their money
and maybe that’s what they’re doing
today maybe they’re gonna let all these
people fail but it really does seem more
like aetherium was a crowd sale it was a
security they had a countdown timer they
sold stock to build a company they built
a company now they have a company I
disagree with the SEC I think they
should have acted sooner which is what
we said in the time period before this
IC o—- madness started breaking out we
said where is the SEC where are the
people who are paid to monitor these
markets we needed warnings we needed
threats we needed a crackdown as much as
everyone’s against regulation and you
could get all mad in the comments
regulation helps protect
people sometimes we can disagree on the
variances of that but I think they
should have acted sooner they waited too
long it is kind of too big to fail but I
don’t know how they’re gonna have a leg
to stand on with any of these I cos if I
was an attorney defending an ICO I would
say aetherium had a crowd sale they had
no product they had no code they had a
countdown timer
they built a company they paid all these
people we know who all of them are we
know where they are we know who the
etherium foundation is they have a
physical location you go knock on it and
you serve them papers if you could do
that to Satoshi Nakamoto they would but
they can’t that’s the difference between
a theorem and Bitcoin and that’s why
this matters so much the government has
taken aside in this battle Wow
I was leave this you said the law that
this might be a backdoor way for AI CEOs
des to win in court I mean that and say
well if etherium can do it but you say
we can’t do it that’s that’s not fair
that’s interesting if they’ve got good
lawyers Ansel were you about to say yeah
Thomas me no no Thomas all the respect
man I respect the hell I do so this is
just a small little disagreement I think
that you said if it was a security they
could do XYZ to aetherium well they can
do that anyway they don’t have to call
it a security they and that’s arbitrary
tomorrow they could go and say well we
learned something new and now it’s a
security right so the the problem is
that we give the government this power
to be arbitrary over us not that we that
it’s it’s a win it’s not a win the win
would be if the SEC said nothing that
would be a win so we just got to fight
their arbitrary power thomas did you
have a thought thoughts on that Thomas
you hear me man ah is he frozen
yeah he’s Thomas uh he looks like he’s
frozen oh man
well here I’ll ask I’ll bring up I’ll
bring up something I want he’ll come
back
I’ll bring up something that is very
interesting had the SEC there he is
Tom so sorry but Ansel I lost my
connection there I didn’t get to hear
what you said sorry oh no I was just
saying that we need to fight the
arbitrary nature of this because you
said that if it was a security the
government could do XYZ well the
government can do that anyway tomorrow
they could come out and say it is a
security because they learned something
new so you know that by supporting
anything the government does you kind of
validate the arbitrary nature of their
power over you I agree they are being
arbitrary in this case but I’m asking
them to follow the laws if they have law
saying this is a security because it
does this then the inspector could
should come in and say this is a
security because it does this when they
break from the laws which is a human
failing versus a law which is written
down which is pretty simple or we
disagree with the language of things but
it’s a human failing and I think it’s
because this market got too big and I
agree they could change their mind it’s
not an official decision but they are
trending this way they are headed in
this way and if you look at the people
who are celebrating in the street today
it’s not the libertarians and the
cypherpunks or the bitcoiners it’s these
big money Wall Street people who were
riding the line there they were like we
don’t know if this is legal we’re gonna
make a million dollars you know that
after we get a million dollars we’ll get
the lawyers we’ll find out if it’s legal
and that’s the difference between you
know someone like myself or John
Carvalho who did not do an IC o—- who
could have done an IC o—- made a
choice no I don’t want to print my own
money I’m into this to stop money
printing and now all the money printers
are rewarded I agree with Adam I think
the I SEOs are totally legal now
I think the SEC made a huge mistake if
aetherium is legal the IC o—- is
illegal is not my choice or my opinion
so what the government seems to be
telling me you got a good lawyer I think
that’s what they’re gonna bring up
Thomas I do what I ask you a question
though if they said yesterday that that
it was that if Tyrion was a security
what would happen to the crypto market
that’s I think that’s why a lot of
people are celebrating because decrypted
market did not crash if they said the
theorem was a security I mean there
would have been some a theorem
crash at least but it would have brought
down a lot of other things too so I mean
did you agree with this guy this guy
would have fallen but perhaps that would
have been good right and I know we’re
talking about creative destruction here
and some people don’t like that but I’ve
been hanging out with JW weatherman
recently and he keeps talking about all
the dumb money in this space and that
they need to be run out and after the
dow collapsed and got hacked because
they wrote bad code they should have
gotten hacked and stayed hacked rolling
back that chain allowed this next level
of madness and once again the SEC as an
enforcer as a regulator is supposed to
regulate this market and keep the
madness out they had a chance after the
Dow they could have stepped in and said
no you lost your money don’t just roll
it back and this is a this is insane
your security times 10 now you’re
repaying people you’re controlling like
who’s the centralized figure it was so
funny yesterday he said that article
he’s like there’s no centralized figure
behind a theorem who do you think rolled
back the chain like who do you think
made this decision and I’m not saying it
was vitalic alone he has a group of
people he works with they have an
ethereal Foundation which they empowered
with the money that they raised from
this illegal security sale like do your
job government like be critical of
government be could have both the laws
or the rules or how they’re written but
if we’ve agreed that we’re gonna have
this regulation you can’t print stocks
you have to follow rules we should have
that regulation it shouldn’t be up for
this guy to say at this time it’s just
too big and it’s too difficult no do
your job all right
any thoughts guys on this before we sum
it all up rest of the panel well I just
wanted to make clear that I don’t I
don’t want a theorem to be a security or
to be classified as a security I think
it is a it under the rules it is a
security but I don’t want it to be
classified security I don’t want it to
not be classified as a security right
and I had a conversation with Bruce
Fenton on Twitter yesterday you know he
thought since I said the SEC made a
mistake he’s saying that I wanted it to
be a security no I just want the SEC to
to dissolve that’s it
as I’ve also I’ll say that well
Jorge any thought it was crazy Americans
in the SEC well that’s that doesn’t
apply here we have different rules here
but I I agree with Angela you know yes
you see to disappear you know and I
don’t care what they I wouldn’t care
what they say but that’s me you know so
we’re going to talk about another source
of well that was a potential source of
FUD but now let’s talk about the tether
situation Ansel do you want to give us
the latest the mainstream media earlier
this week picked up they finally found
out about this tether thing that oh it
might have pumped up the price of
Bitcoin even though there were flood
stirs talking about it months and months
ago now the mainstream media decided to
talk about tether some and it brought
the price of Bitcoin down in terms of
dollars again value your wealth and
bitcoins doesn’t matter what it’s worth
in dollars think long term pound that
like button check out these guys links
below all right sorry okay so add so
what’s going on with tether well I don’t
think the tether the tether FUD this
time around brought the price down very
much I think we’re just in a really soft
weak market right now so the the price
is moving right it’s going sideways
that’s why I’ve been saying on my show
for multiple months now is we’re just in
a sideways market consolidation period
but I’ve been a staunch opponent to this
tether fed from the beginning when other
people were having bit the next on their
show and given him the mic I was like
what the heck are you doing right you’re
just perpetuating this FUD and now like
we wouldn’t even have this in the
mainstream media if those early shows
hadn’t perpetuated this whole narrative
in the first place right so be careful
about where you’re getting your
information from the next thing I have
here is that it’s pure projection from
the mainstream media right because the
dollar is what’s pumped the dollar is
what is printed out of nowhere and used
to pump up the stock market bond market
everything is pumped up from the the US
dollar at least in the United States and
and
it causes problems everywhere so this is
just projection from the mainstream
media saying that look there they’re
printing tether which is making Bitcoin
go up but they they won’t admit that the
reason why the stock market is going up
is because they’re printing US dollars
so I think slowly but surely that
realization will sink into people what
did you think about this report that
they glorified I mean that the
mainstream media’s were picked that they
were picking up on that that’s what they
kept that was their crutch they’re like
there’s a report that says you know as a
formal report that says tether pumped up
the price of a Bitcoin during the during
the the pump during earlier in late last
year I didn’t read the whole thing I I
noticed that people were talking about
multiple you know factual errors in
there so it’s it’s just they can make
any you know what is it lies damn lies
and statistics so they can just make
anything look true it’s fun Thomas
what’s what are your thoughts sure I
would agree with Ansel I’d say you can
prove anything with statistics
ninety-nine percent of all people know
that so and we are going sideways we’re
going sideways down though I didn’t
really think this was a report was Fudd
I definitely covered the BitFenix tether
story six months ago or whatever I
covered the Det story BitFenix going
into debt printing their own token
buying back the debt after they got
hacked very question it will start to
this whole story then they start
printing the tether and from the
specific report they said that they used
the tether on linked markets to buy
altcoins so you’d have a pump in a osore
aetherium or like corn or whatever after
it pumped everybody’s buying in they’re
all excited they sell on the people that
are pumping get the Bitcoin trade the
Bitcoin for USD with the USD back into
tether and do it again so we have some
pretty convincing ways to do it if you
look at the 66 page research paper
presented by the University of Texas
they analyzed the blockchain so they
watch the money moving out and from from
bid for next and they were able to see
this circle of money going around
so that’s a factual evidence I don’t
know how are you going to defeat that
and I’ve been against Heather the whole
time they allegedly were holding this
money in a bank account so if you held
it one tether they’d have $1 for you in
a bank account and anybody who’s paying
attention knows that’s the same as gold
certificates and they always print more
gold certificates than I have gold they
never link up right tethers much the
same way they kept printing this money
they kept driving up the price
one good thing I’d say when they’re at
the top they kept printing as well to
try to keep the price up the other side
to this and why I think it’s not just a
one-day story and that this will be a
bigger story and that the media will
keep covering it is we don’t know who
benefited yet we know a lot of strange
facts and there’s another article out
there on medium only get the title it’s
something about 15 in a cartel and it
says uncovering the real cartel in
Bitcoin and I’m gonna agree with you
this is a conspiracy theory it’s not
well written it’s way too long but he
basically implicates several of the
major players the people who owned
exchanges the people who invested in
every company and that they’re at the
top of this thing making a boatload of
money and if you know these people would
they be against making a boatload of
money no do they necessarily believe in
government regulations or money
laundering no so I think we’ve got a
real problem
I think they drove up the price of
Bitcoin I’m a big believer in Bitcoin I
think it’s the world’s money I just
don’t know when two years five years ten
years if you were institutional money
and you saw this market be so easily
manipulated would you put your
institutional money in I’m afraid that
maybe if you’re gonna do it in two years
now you’re gonna do it in five now
you’re gonna do an intent so I’m afraid
of the chart we’re in a downtrend the
chart people say I’m afraid of the news
and basically whereas before I would say
well bitcoin was once 20k so it’ll
always be 20k is what I said when it was
1200 when it went down to 300 but then
we found that was fake too
with the MAL Cox and the willy bots so
we need more demand we need more people
buying Bitcoin getting into Bitcoin if
we don’t they’re gonna keep printing new
bitcoins every day you
we’re gonna keep not buying them the
price is gonna keep going down so I
don’t think it’s fun I hate to be
negative a hate to be bearish I’m trying
to be honest here and that’s the way I
take this report in this situation well
the the crux of that the important piece
is not the tether right the important
piece is the altcoins
so you shouldn’t blame tether tether is
one-to-one and there’s been multiple I
mean you can say that it’s not we did
stop they stopped auditing tether one of
the major stories in the the FUD run-up
or whatever you want to call it is they
stopped auditing so I know I don’t know
that it’s wonderful
correct but look at look at the the
exchanges like you know some of the big
quote-unquote stakeholders in tether are
Polonia acts and bit treks and all these
guys that are using tether so I if I my
exchange was gonna be using tether I
would want to audit it myself at least
so there’s there’s got to be some sort
of oversight over that it can’t be pure
fluff where these all coins is all coins
are the pure inflation piece not the
tether the all coins need to get all the
blame
not tether I I don’t know I mean if you
were in on it you wouldn’t need to audit
it you know it’s a skin you’d get paid
from the scam so who cares about
auditing a scam that’s working for you
you don’t need to fix a fixed fight a
collusion always breaks down so you
can’t you can’t trust that and people in
Bitcoin know that so if I were Polonius
running that I wouldn’t orb it treks
whatever I wouldn’t trust like some guy
a bit phone X to not stab me in the back
I would make sure it’s there well I
think that’s where we are right now with
this story we we believe there might
have been manipulation because of the
blockchain evidence but on the other
side who did it who benefited and which
one of them is going to crack first
which one’s going to ran out the other
ones try to get a better deal are they
going to expand this investigation I
hate to say it but from a mainstream
media perspective and I agree it’s all
hype it’s all BS bitcoins the truth the
code is good lightning networks awesome
I’m with you guys but from a mainstream
media perspective this is a multi-day
story it’s a
because it’s about Bitcoin is about lots
of money it’s about criminals people
stealing this money manipulating markets
it’s salacious right and here’s a
headline from the Express and this is a
UK tabloid totally a tabloid I’m telling
it but here’s the headline and has lots
of all caps and it says proof Bitcoin
fever was a scam report claims crypto
price was manipulated so that’s just day
one day two is big people in exchanges
manipulated the price so and so is a big
hero of Bitcoin but he’s manipulated
price they ratted them out they’re going
to jail to get lawyers all of this has
to unfold so I just think it’s a
multi-day story we’re in it now you’ve
got to make your choices if you’re gonna
buy or sell if you have enough money for
six months for a year for two years
you’re good you got a good job you’re
investing dollar cost averaging not more
than you can afford to lose you’re good
but if you don’t have six months if you
don’t have a year you need to make some
moves you need to protect yourself I
love holding I like doing it but you
have to have enough money for rent and
food yeah I think sorry Adam let me say
one more thing is yeah it might scare
away some retail investors because they
believe everything they read in the
tabloids on the tabloid headlines but
for the institutional investors they’re
not going to see that headline and give
it any weight whatsoever so the
investors that count for this price are
the ones that are going to be able to
see through this narrative this fuck
I’ve got two things to say in it first
of all I’m again I’m in touch with a lot
of people who in foreign countries who
want a bunch of Bitcoin they can’t get
it they cannot get a so I you know on
one end we have this mainstream fear I
guess but I think on the on the ground
realities there are no one is selling
their Bitcoin people in theory if this
was true people should be scared out of
pants at all
I’ll sell to us you know just just wait
like Thomas said some people have to pay
their bills well they’re not enough of
those people they’re for large for
people to get large amounts right now I
would just say that and to reassure
everyone out there
I know it’s not the exact same subject
but it deals with this subject I mean
there’s a anyway there’s so the other
thing I wanted to say was we’re talking
did this story Thomas did this story
mention that Polonius had something is a
player in all this is Polonius being
accused here in in this in this bit
finna is as playing around in this I’d
say he’s got a in addition he says
Polonius coin desk and other parties
appear to be peripherally involved okay
so that does say the main ones for him
and I’m not accusing these people I’m
not saying they’re guilty of anything
this is allegedly this is not a great
article but he says BitFenix tether
crackin Barry Silbert
Roger ver Erik Voorhees the cm II and
many other actors in the apart in the
market appear to be connected together
and complicit in market manipulation of
some sort that goes a little too deep
there so there’s some of this guy is
totally conspiracy but the Polonia axe
thing if Polonius was involved in this
at all yeah things have changed since
then they’re corporately owned they they
have uh you know they’re being forgiven
for everything they wouldn’t be the
people to chirp they would be the people
to speak about what happened because
they’re they’re immune now and that I
would think they would want to clear
their conscience and everything since
they’re corporately owned I’m just
throwing that out there
again i I don’t know how deep this runs
and I don’t know how I’m for it I I know
Thomas’s worry I’m not I’m not too
worried I’m not worried about this but
but but again I will see if they keep
some coming up in the news how people
talking about it their their legitimate
reasons to consider it definitely
definitely uh anyway do you guys have
anything else to say about it I have one
more thing don’t forget the the buyer of
Polonius is launching a competitor to
tether right so we don’t know like this
is going to be a tether run by Goldman
Sachs and they’re just clearing the
field that’s what I think they’re just
clear in the field of tether and that
should be the overriding concern it’s
letting these big
get in here and control this because
they will manipulate we know they will
manipulate it like I trust Phill Potter
at Biffen X more than I trust these
goldman sachs types right so that’s a
point to consider another u.s. DC token
the circle dollar back token they keep
going after these dollar back tokens to
try to understand it from their
perspective
I think Goldman Sachs wants to charge
fees so if you put $100 in account you
could pay $10 fees for 10 months but if
the accounts in Bitcoin or all coins or
whatever it goes up and down you can’t
get your fees every month that’s their
reason for doing this but I think the
other reason like Ansel says is going to
be manipulation and it’s going to happen
again even bigger so I that’s
interesting theory though that the
tether might be it might be attacked
because someone wants to clear the way
for a more corporate competitor but the
thing is eventually we’re not even going
to need these type of coins this is an
important point too once it’s easy just
to get dollars to Bitcoin I mean all
tether is is just a replacement for not
to make it easy to buy Bitcoin without
dollars and eventually we’ll uh we’ll
move on from this and these stable coins
I think will be a thing we laugh at like
how we laugh at the internet it’s funny
though because if you think about a
decentralized exchange right now you can
really only change crypto to crypto
Bitcoin for light coin or whatever you
can’t really get USD so if you were
trying to hedge and you didn’t want to
touch coin base and you didn’t want to
just get dollars and do the hassle if
there was a coin like tether that worked
and if there was a decentralized
exchange that worked really good at
bisque is getting better and things it
would be perfect for the decentralized
exchange because you could move your
money into fiat and you could have you
know percentage of your money in a fiat
so it would serve a purpose there but
that’s not what I think they’re building
it for all right Jorge I left yeah I
don’t know if you know about the teller
stuff you’ve won to say anything about
it or a little bit not
you know I try to follow in order to be
knowledgeable about the whole space but
we are not done that tether is not an
issue here among Argentinians right yeah
I think it’s a very important like we
say Argentina is the first world but
this is one of those cases like first
world problems I mean they got better
things to worry about in you know I
guess you I wanted to ask you how can
tether hurt Bitcoin I mean Bitcoin is
uncontestable it’s decentralized you
know you can’t co-opt it where the
tether is centralized and it can be
manipulated so I think that given the
choice I mean it’s very easy I don’t
want either I won Bitcoin
how can it be a threat to Bitcoin I mean
that and that is the question it’s
because of what it did it possibly
pumped up the price of Bitcoin and that
it’s a pool or pumping up prices and
that all the crypto currencies
valuations are fake and that then people
won’t want to be involved with crypto
currencies dollar value of Bitcoin will
go down but we value our wealth in
Bitcoin and it’s it’s a it’s a tool for
people in different countries to get
their money but to make sure their money
isn’t uncommon scalable it does you know
tether pumping in the price of Bitcoin
doesn’t negate the fact that Bitcoin is
unconscious capable and I think
eventually everyone will calm down and
realize that but but again you know
dollar value of Bitcoin is something
that is important to a lot of very
wealthy people and any any person a
people are used to valuing their wealth
in in dollars just like in Argentina so
I mean it’s that’s why I do you guys
have anything to add I just I just worry
about these greedy people who are
willing to break the law and that
bitcoin is a great market and one
Bitcoin is one Bitcoin and if you hold
it you hold it and all this manipulation
all this price-fixing like Adam said it
hurts our ability to know the price of
Bitcoin I used to think the price of
Bitcoin was 20k or 10k or whatever now I
just don’t know and I just don’t have as
much information as I used to have
because this is under
my ability to believe in the information
that I was given you brought up with it
with Mal Cox and how that you thought
back that oh it’s worth 1100 but then
you found out that it was fake but I
think we’re and and if this is similar
if it was pump and I’m not saying this
if it was pump to 20,000 because of
crazy manipulation then we’ve just gone
through the cycle again we’ve seen and
what I always say is that cryptocurrency
Bitcoin it’s all cyclical so I have no
doubt that even though it reached 20,000
in a fake way and I’m not saying it did
that it will return because it did it
before it was able to eclipse a fake
high before and that wasn’t because of
it I mean it didn’t get to $3,000
because of manipulation I don’t think
anyone’s saying that but I just think if
people have a long term view of this a
long term picture if this is very
similar to that and if even if it’s
bigger it’s still psychologically it was
a 20,000 once if it’ll get you just have
to be patient and I know Thomas you said
well is it is it gonna be two years
three years four years five years well
who knows that that deck that’s up for
discussion definitely but I did want to
say that we can look at this as a
cyclical type of thing also and restore
restore our confidence that yes it shall
return definitely I definitely agree
with that and I’d say if we’re in a
battle and this is a battle to make
Bitcoin the number one currency in its
battle against all the other currencies
and everything you didn’t think it was
going to be easy did you you didn’t
think it was just gonna go straight up
the whole way I mean there are bumps in
this road and this feels like a bump
yeah I mean that’s the best way of
saying it that’s it’s not it’s not gonna
be easy if this is if this is a threat
then it’s a threat but they’ll be up
there but as I say they’re gonna be days
it goes down by a thousand they’re gonna
be days it goes up by a thousand it’s
not gonna be various you you gotta have
a strong hand people bound that like
what all right well let’s uh unless
Ansel has anything to add yeah I just
want to say that Heather was useful for
arbitrage right so it did help the price
somewhat when it’s stable and there’s no
food around it
it can actually help the price I think
like what was the total market cap at
either like 5 billion or something like
that what’s the total market cap of
these altcoins
I mean aetherium alone is 50 billion and
it’s worthless so the the main source of
the you know inflation or the
manipulation isn’t from tether it’s a I
mean it it’s driven by the inflation of
the all coins I mean look at the
dominance index it’s like 40 percent
right so that means 60 percent of this
market is pure inflationary effect on
the price of Bitcoin so all of these
people are really worried about tether
is because they don’t understand that
all coins are shit that all coins are
worthless all they are is a source of
inflation they keep coming out with new
all coins or new icos every day putting
more fake value into the system to pump
up the price so I I think there could be
something to say about tether negatively
but that we’re looking at it from the
wrong angle tethers not the worst part
it’s the altcoins and aetherium and and
ripple and all those that’s the source
of the inflation when actually having
said that I’m I’m talking to an so when
when we are we gonna start seeing the
all coins being weeded out after you I
agree with with ansel or what he just
said but are they gonna be weeded out at
some point and when well there’s a
there’s a saying that blockchains can’t
die right they always they’ll just some
one person will keep them alive but they
can be delisted from exchanges and
there’s these narratives that you see or
memes in the marketplace smart contract
platform unstoppable code that died
pretty quick right with the dow so we’ll
see this smart contract platform meme
kind of died out and I don’t think their
market caps will ever go to zero but
they might be in the you know
double-digit millions instead
double-digit billions and we’ll just get
the next narrative the the one I see
coming up is securities tokens right so
all the everyone’s kind of in a race to
be the security exchange the security
token exchange and that will be a next
source of inflation for the price but
yeah I don’t think that they will ever
die completely but they will be very
insignificant I think we’re on the verge
of a system where there’s gonna be some
big survivors there’ll be a top tier but
but there’ll be a bunch of little ones
that people just day trade and people
flip around I don’t know I’m thinking
too after the next having but probably
toward 2024 and you know if the whole
environment changes so fast I mean I
remember but before whatever was as late
as 2015 it was only like feathercoin and
whatever was on BTC – yeah just it
changes so fast so it’s hard to predict
but I think some of these little ones
are gonna be left in the dust I mean it
depends on how big the ico craze remains
and now you know it seems like it could
it could grow larger now since people
are very enthusiastic about it Thomas
you’ve any thoughts on that on this
would Jorge say sure I just think it’s
funny how much things have changed over
the past three to five years like Adam
said teather coin earth coin
terrico and prime coin 42 coin a one
coin that was a single coin with a
number one all of these have come and
gone and everyone’s always like why do
you guys not believe in all coins I’ve
just got a bag of this I think it’s
great and they’re excited and we’re like
I’ve seen it a thousand of times I’m
with Bitcoin the other ones just live
and die Bitcoin lives forever so I’m
with Bitcoin now but what’s so funny now
is that there’s so much money in this
space and I don’t know whether it was
this tethered pump or if it’s just other
rich people or pump groups or whatever
but there will be a feathercoin pump
tomorrow there will be a Tarricone pump
tomorrow like this aetherium thing maybe
the project dies and everyone stops
coding it but Jimmy and Johnny decided
to pump it yesterday and it went up 20%
everything I’m afraid it’s gonna be much
much much harder like Ansel said
blockchain every
is much harder for these things to die
now that there’s so much money and
there’s just stupid money and they’re
just pumping things so I think they’re
gonna stick around well credit card
fraud won’t go ever go away and the
Nigerian prince scam so they’ll never go
away right so but they are insignificant
at least if you’re smart and you don’t
fall for that stuff so yeah there could
a theorem could live on for you know 20
30 years from now but not very many
people will be scammed as compared to
today Wow it’s all cyclical as I say
okay so we’re gonna get to the
conclusion airy remarks here but I’m
gonna ask Thomas one specific thing tell
us about the Vegas meet up and making
Vegas the crypto capital of the United
States or what’s going on there I’m
excited oh well first I’ll talk about
the vision then I’ll talk about what
we’re actually doing so far and the
visions more exciting but I visit Vegas
like everybody else I go to a convention
or I go to a show or something and I fly
out and it’s a fun place to visit the
flights are cheap they built these huge
suburbs around the strip now there’s
tons of houses and they’re pretty big
and good-sized especially compared to a
small apartment in San Francisco so for
a variety of reasons and there’s also
down at Fremont Street there’s a ton of
Bitcoin ATMs they’re everywhere the D
casino takes Bitcoin the Golden Gate
takes Bitcoin they have a cafe they have
a Bitcoin ATM there’s must be 20 or 30
Bitcoin ATMs in the city so whereas in
San Francisco or Sacramento there’s not
really a lot of Bitcoin community or
activity here I really felt that there
could be so I decided to move here and I
started a little bit coin meetup
unfortunately the main Bitcoin meetup
here with 700 people in it the way that
meetup comm works is they charge you to
keep a meet-up so if you stop paying
they just kind of orphan your meetup so
the orphaned Bitcoin meetup of old days
got taken over by be cashiers and
they’re putting up all these
demonstrations of how to put your be
cash in a treasure and all these kind of
things and those get you know three
people and then they have a general
Bitcoin meetup and 30 people show up so
I think there is a Bitcoin community
here I’m just trying to reach them so we
have Bitcoin Las Vegas org you can sign
up to join the meetup so far we’ve just
had some kind of basic hangout
meet ups at a bar but eventually we do
hope to get a group of people together a
regular time and to hand out flyers to
the more than forty million tourists
that come to Las Vegas every year and
normally you’re not that interested in a
flyer you’re not that interested in
Bitcoin but if you’re in Las Vegas
you’re on vacation so if I come up to
you and a nice attitude and I tell you
about Bitcoin and I say hey if you come
over here you put twenty bucks a machine
you get some Bitcoin you take it home
they might give it a try it might be a
little ride or an experience for them
and they’ve already lost twenty dollars
in a slot machine they don’t care and if
they can just do that put that twenty
bucks in take it home take the flyer
which is going to have information on
how to get more or whatever that kind of
thing take it to their buddies in Iowa
and say I bought this crazy Bitcoin in
Vegas and you know it’s twenty two
dollars and now it’s 15 dollars or now
it’s twenty two dollars or whatever and
they tell their buddy and their buddy
says I want 20 bucks in that too and now
we’re spreading the word about Bitcoin
and it doesn’t have to be Las Vegas you
can do this at home you can start your
own Bitcoin meetup and you can hand out
flyers and if especially if you have a
Bitcoin ATM in your town that’s a great
way to say hey just put 20 bucks in you
know don’t invest too much don’t risk it
or anything but try out this new
currency it’s like email you don’t have
anybody to email right now but maybe
someday you will and so we’re just
trying to spread the word that’s a great
rationale for having in in Vegas – I
like that as people are just tall some
money all around it might not hit the
tourists that are there that’s a this is
a very good idea so yeah and also if you
want to visit if you want to come on
down to Vegas we’re gonna have a
hopefully if we get someone to visit on
a cheap flight we’ll have a speaker
we’ll have them back here to the studios
we’ll do an interview and then you can
enjoy Vegas you can do whatever you like
to do I will say there are many cheap
flights there people many Spirit
Airlines guess the hair if you want to
just go for a weekend on spirit just
don’t bring any bags with you and you’ll
be get real cheap and uh uh and this
makes me want to toss it you know Vegas
is very easy very hot so I don’t know
I’ve said bad things about Vegas before
but this kind of thing makes me want to
return to Vegas definitely so III wish
you all the luck and uh let’s keep and
hopefully have a big
maybe there’ll be a big like real
Bitcoin event they’re like convention or
whatever the Thomas hunt world crypto
Network people elite a Bitcoin event no
I I hate to spoil it but we’re
definitely working on that idea and we’d
like to do a community based convention
not about the big names or the big
people but just all the normal people if
you like Bitcoin if you watch these
shows and I bet a lot of you are like I
talk back to the screen I yell at you
all the time and if you want to come you
know you yell at me in person or yell at
Ansel in person I think it’d be super
fun to have that kind of a
community-based convention it’s not
about icos or big money or the stock
people and they can come to and hang out
but it’s about the community you’re on
the right track they’re awesome twenty
probably call it the chat box convention
no event you get guys cursing wildly but
saying like conspiracy theory chat box I
don’t know if that’s a good day you
don’t encourage behavior that is out of
this world oh good anyway Jorge what are
your key your conclusionary thoughts
down in snowy Argentina well I want just
I just want to say that my feeling is as
we’re at home despite all the things I
have tried to explain to you guys I hope
you you sort of were able to understand
the complex situation here I was in Tina
I personally do not see that we’re going
into any type of hyperinflation anytime
soon which is good news and I think the
people in government right now are are
getting it or getting it they need to
shrink the government to lower taxes
there’s only it’s the only way out
otherwise the country is not viable I
think they got the message so in that
regard I’m optimistic one one quick
final question when is the next
presidential election now and 2019 ooh
oh my god I hope they don’t elect okay
that’s a whole nother show all right and
so what is your
because it’s all out the window if the
opposition gets elected and so what’s uh
what are your conclusion airy thoughts
anything that we left out anything you
want to bring up I just wanna say it’s
honor to be on your show Adam thank you
I try to make it on as much as I can you
ask me you know every couple months you
ask me and I can’t make it but it’s
honored to be on here with your guests
you always have really good shows really
good guests on and I love your lines you
know strong hands 20 20 all that stuff
because that’s super super important the
whole hold mentality is is really
important and it was honored to be on
with Jorge and Thomas thank you it’s an
honor and a privilege to have all of you
guys on it was a it’s a great show the
people out there who understand what
this is about I try to I try to bring
you different perspectives different
news no one’s talking about Argentina
now and and in the end it really blends
in with everything because you see that
first half-hour show this is why we
people need Bitcoin the people who say
there’s no use case watch that first
half-hour so real quick my final thought
is speaking of events great time here in
Florida I’m gonna need Porto Rico
starting the 20th to the 28th and very
important Bitcoin rodeo calm that is in
Calgary on the 9th and 10th of July
Bitcoin rodeo calm check it out BTC
penny vortex will be there some other
dude all sorts of dudes that you guys
know will be there ok so thanks a lot
everyone I do this show this weekend
Bitcoin every Friday we’ll have some
amazing guests till next Friday tomorrow
is the beyond Bitcoin show that’s every
Saturday and all the other days of the
week is just the regular one Bitcoin
show but you never know what’s going to
happen there is a new show posted here
every day at least one and of course you
can hear these on the world crypto
Network podcast you can hear Thomas’s
shows on there actually also and ansel
shows on the world crypto network
podcast that the great Corey puts
together so check out that that’s linked
to below these guys are linked to below
i’m adam meister the bitcoinmeister the
disrupt meister remember subscribe this
channel like this video share this video
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see you later have a great weekend bye
bye everyone

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5 Comments

  • Reply Pua Subterráneo June 15, 2018 at 9:27 pm

    we say "estamos en el horno"

  • Reply john Chesterfield June 15, 2018 at 9:42 pm

    The Las Vegas meetup had a tech guy show up who moved to Las Vegas. Las Vegas is a tech center. I saw a Bitcoin slot machine advertised here.

  • Reply Ansel Lindner June 16, 2018 at 3:10 am

    I'm going to get you a lamp Adam. Lol

  • Reply Plex ASM June 16, 2018 at 4:07 am

    Did bitcoin get to 5k without tether manipulation? Oh alright then I'm not worried

    Great show adam

  • Reply CR1545 June 17, 2018 at 7:14 pm

    Steemit want's me to agree to they're new terms of Service and Privacy Policy when i went to place a post today. What's up with that? Is Steemit the new Facebbok? Thoughts? Thanks.. down below. Hi Adam! Hello Argentina..:)

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